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	<title>Comments on: Discrimination?</title>
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	<link>http://www.sourceguru.net/archives/144</link>
	<description></description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 01 Dec 2008 21:30:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Mez</title>
		<link>http://www.sourceguru.net/archives/144#comment-23290</link>
		<dc:creator>Mez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Aug 2008 00:53:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sourceguru.net/?p=144#comment-23290</guid>
		<description>nothing wrong with an employer deciding to ban smoking on his premises... the point here is... even if you only smoke outside of work, they wont employ you</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>nothing wrong with an employer deciding to ban smoking on his premises&#8230; the point here is&#8230; even if you only smoke outside of work, they wont employ you</p>
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		<title>By: jerichokb</title>
		<link>http://www.sourceguru.net/archives/144#comment-23289</link>
		<dc:creator>jerichokb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Aug 2008 00:38:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sourceguru.net/?p=144#comment-23289</guid>
		<description>There is no such thing as a specific 'right to smoke'. Any illusion of such a right comes from the idea that we can do as we please. We can-and should be able to-but only within the limit that we shouldn't be able to do something if it causes harm (J.S. Mill's harm principle). There are plenty of harms (both actual and slightly less tangible, such as the damage to social interaction between smokers and non-smokers who simply can't stand the smell etc) in smoking.

I don't recall any big fuss smokers made over bars and restaurants that specifically chose to prohibit smoking on their premises before the smoking ban - so why a fuss over an employer deciding of his own volition to ban smoking on his premises? It seems the smokers are afraid they'll lose their wonderful cancersticks completely...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is no such thing as a specific &#8216;right to smoke&#8217;. Any illusion of such a right comes from the idea that we can do as we please. We can-and should be able to-but only within the limit that we shouldn&#8217;t be able to do something if it causes harm (J.S. Mill&#8217;s harm principle). There are plenty of harms (both actual and slightly less tangible, such as the damage to social interaction between smokers and non-smokers who simply can&#8217;t stand the smell etc) in smoking.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t recall any big fuss smokers made over bars and restaurants that specifically chose to prohibit smoking on their premises before the smoking ban - so why a fuss over an employer deciding of his own volition to ban smoking on his premises? It seems the smokers are afraid they&#8217;ll lose their wonderful cancersticks completely&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Mez</title>
		<link>http://www.sourceguru.net/archives/144#comment-23205</link>
		<dc:creator>Mez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Aug 2008 12:50:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sourceguru.net/?p=144#comment-23205</guid>
		<description>John. Yes it is anyones own right and own freedom to smoke if they wish. You CANNOT take that right away from someone. Your point may be valid, but if the person wants to, they have the right to smoke. It's the same as if I want to, I have the right to shave my hair off..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John. Yes it is anyones own right and own freedom to smoke if they wish. You CANNOT take that right away from someone. Your point may be valid, but if the person wants to, they have the right to smoke. It&#8217;s the same as if I want to, I have the right to shave my hair off..</p>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://www.sourceguru.net/archives/144#comment-23202</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 Aug 2008 09:31:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sourceguru.net/?p=144#comment-23202</guid>
		<description>"Personally, I think it’s my own right and own freedom to smoke if I wish."

No, it isn't. _Don't even try to go that way_. There is no benefit from smoking. Not a single one. It's exactly the opposite. Smoking doesn't calm you down, and endangers everybody (that includes the smoker and the non-smokers).

My first wife died with lung cancer ans she was a passive smoker: her co-workers smoked, back when it was legal and ok/cool to smoke.

I also find amusing when smokers compare themselves with people with diabetes and parents of disabled kids.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Personally, I think it’s my own right and own freedom to smoke if I wish.&#8221;</p>
<p>No, it isn&#8217;t. _Don&#8217;t even try to go that way_. There is no benefit from smoking. Not a single one. It&#8217;s exactly the opposite. Smoking doesn&#8217;t calm you down, and endangers everybody (that includes the smoker and the non-smokers).</p>
<p>My first wife died with lung cancer ans she was a passive smoker: her co-workers smoked, back when it was legal and ok/cool to smoke.</p>
<p>I also find amusing when smokers compare themselves with people with diabetes and parents of disabled kids.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Taylor</title>
		<link>http://www.sourceguru.net/archives/144#comment-23194</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Taylor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 23:19:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sourceguru.net/?p=144#comment-23194</guid>
		<description>"It’s legal because you can’t choose your “sex, race, age, religion, or ethnic group, or individuals with disabilities” but you CAN choose whether to smoke or not"

I think you'll find that individuals can choose their religion! as I do not follow my parents religion being a passionate atheist. 

And they can also choose self inflicted disabilities such as obesity and don't give me all that jazz about how people can't help it as you can't possibly put on more weight than than the calorific content of what you eat. Obviously that should only affect employment opportunities in a few countries like the US where they don't have a state health structure and health plans are provided as job benefits, so I figure it should be okay to say no fatties and no chimneys, heck its their company they should be able to employ who they please.

Incidentally I gave up smoking three years ago and for me its been a good thing but I wouldn't want to force that on others like the anti-smoking Nazi's around here.

"As an aside.. I recently had to visit a specialist medical practitioner with my daughter. She had a condition which was exacerbated by cigarette smoke. Neither my wife nor I smoke, but other family members do. The Professor we saw said that even if family members smoke outside, when they come in they continue to breathe out very nasty particulates over the rest of the family."

Stop it, Stop it, how long did it take you to invent that twoddle! There are a lot worse viral pathogens in the air than the smell of smoke on a smokers breath.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;It’s legal because you can’t choose your “sex, race, age, religion, or ethnic group, or individuals with disabilities” but you CAN choose whether to smoke or not&#8221;</p>
<p>I think you&#8217;ll find that individuals can choose their religion! as I do not follow my parents religion being a passionate atheist. </p>
<p>And they can also choose self inflicted disabilities such as obesity and don&#8217;t give me all that jazz about how people can&#8217;t help it as you can&#8217;t possibly put on more weight than than the calorific content of what you eat. Obviously that should only affect employment opportunities in a few countries like the US where they don&#8217;t have a state health structure and health plans are provided as job benefits, so I figure it should be okay to say no fatties and no chimneys, heck its their company they should be able to employ who they please.</p>
<p>Incidentally I gave up smoking three years ago and for me its been a good thing but I wouldn&#8217;t want to force that on others like the anti-smoking Nazi&#8217;s around here.</p>
<p>&#8220;As an aside.. I recently had to visit a specialist medical practitioner with my daughter. She had a condition which was exacerbated by cigarette smoke. Neither my wife nor I smoke, but other family members do. The Professor we saw said that even if family members smoke outside, when they come in they continue to breathe out very nasty particulates over the rest of the family.&#8221;</p>
<p>Stop it, Stop it, how long did it take you to invent that twoddle! There are a lot worse viral pathogens in the air than the smell of smoke on a smokers breath.</p>
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		<title>By: jh</title>
		<link>http://www.sourceguru.net/archives/144#comment-23191</link>
		<dc:creator>jh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 21:36:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sourceguru.net/?p=144#comment-23191</guid>
		<description>It's legal, and it's a good thing.

My company has a similar policy.  It saves our insurance an average of between 30% and 70%. 

That saves the company money, and that means we get more in our paychecks.  

It comes down to the insurance companies.  They're raising rates faster for smokers than they are for non-smokers, and that eats into cost.   Studies basically prove that smokers die at an alarmingly faster rate.  Even those who don't get cancer have secondary problems that kill them and cost money on the way out.  Companies don't want to pay that.. and so they don't.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s legal, and it&#8217;s a good thing.</p>
<p>My company has a similar policy.  It saves our insurance an average of between 30% and 70%. </p>
<p>That saves the company money, and that means we get more in our paychecks.  </p>
<p>It comes down to the insurance companies.  They&#8217;re raising rates faster for smokers than they are for non-smokers, and that eats into cost.   Studies basically prove that smokers die at an alarmingly faster rate.  Even those who don&#8217;t get cancer have secondary problems that kill them and cost money on the way out.  Companies don&#8217;t want to pay that.. and so they don&#8217;t.</p>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://www.sourceguru.net/archives/144#comment-23189</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 20:40:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sourceguru.net/?p=144#comment-23189</guid>
		<description>ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!

I think it's fantastic.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!</p>
<p>I think it&#8217;s fantastic.</p>
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		<title>By: ThinRhino</title>
		<link>http://www.sourceguru.net/archives/144#comment-23187</link>
		<dc:creator>ThinRhino</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 19:43:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sourceguru.net/?p=144#comment-23187</guid>
		<description>Well.. smoking kills and suicide is illegal... so.. just c if that can help u somewhere!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well.. smoking kills and suicide is illegal&#8230; so.. just c if that can help u somewhere!!</p>
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		<title>By: smitty</title>
		<link>http://www.sourceguru.net/archives/144#comment-23186</link>
		<dc:creator>smitty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 19:42:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sourceguru.net/?p=144#comment-23186</guid>
		<description>@ Midnightsun 
"This is ridiculous.  Should employers be allowed to discriminate on the basis of Obesity?"

I have two words for you: Fashion Models.

In fact, consider that almost any professional athletic organization already does this.  How many short fat NBA players have you ever see?  Yes, employers should discriminate when hiring employees.


@Antonio:
Why does it suck that a person who owns and operates a business can run it as she sees fit?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Midnightsun<br />
&#8220;This is ridiculous.  Should employers be allowed to discriminate on the basis of Obesity?&#8221;</p>
<p>I have two words for you: Fashion Models.</p>
<p>In fact, consider that almost any professional athletic organization already does this.  How many short fat NBA players have you ever see?  Yes, employers should discriminate when hiring employees.</p>
<p>@Antonio:<br />
Why does it suck that a person who owns and operates a business can run it as she sees fit?</p>
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		<title>By: Antonio</title>
		<link>http://www.sourceguru.net/archives/144#comment-23183</link>
		<dc:creator>Antonio</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 Aug 2008 17:55:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.sourceguru.net/?p=144#comment-23183</guid>
		<description>It sucks that it's legal :-(</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It sucks that it&#8217;s legal <img src='http://www.sourceguru.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_sad.gif' alt=':-(' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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